Saturday, 2 July 2011

Yeah? Yeah? Really? Bloody prove it then.

Two articles in the Wail today, one about half of the Tory MP's wanting to leave the EU and another about, errrm, half of the Tory MP's wanting to leave the EU.

Trooper Thompson nails it in spades over at his place and I find it difficult not to echo the same sentiments.

I am no Tory, however so important do I believe the issue of our continued membership in the EU to be that if at the next election the party made it clear that a vote for the Tories was a vote to get out, or at least have a referendum on the issue, that I would vote for them without hesitation. Even if the rest of the policy book was about putting kittens in microwaves and coating the cliffs of Dover in custard, I'd still vote for them. So much of our sovereignty has been handed over that nothing else matters, if we don't take that power back the issue of debt, cuts, taxation, law and order, smoking, databases, all of it, is just jigging around on the sideline like a 4 year old at a wedding reception disco.

So here's a message to all the Conservative MP's; if the reportage in the Mail is accurate (and I appreciate that it may not be), then grow a fucking pair and force the issue.

We've heard time and time again, especially during the expenses scandal, that MP's enter the job with the sincerely held intention to make a difference. Well now is the time to step up and bloody prove it.

The old doubts will come in. Is it better to be in power than to risk everything by sticking your head above the parapet? The answer is a simple no. Where is your self respect? You have an amazing opportunity to make a difference, take it. You bloody managed it in the face of the party machinery over live animals performing in circuses, you can do it on a really important issue.

Without doubt the LibDems would start cutting up rough about it, but you know what? You have to be true to your beliefs, your membership's beliefs and more importantly, your constituent's beliefs. My experience tells me that the vast majority of people are now thoroughly sick and fed up to the back teeth with the EU.

I'm not making a demand that we withdraw from the EU, but I think we at least deserve the opportunity to have our say. If an in/out referendum goes the way of 'in', then fair enough. What is not fair is that Cameron talks of cast-iron guarantees as a tool to keep the party membership happy, and then totally betrays that. Not good enough. It also means that I will never again believe a word he tells me. Why should you?

This duplicity means that your party is in real, real trouble. I know, for I have seen it with my own eyes. On Tuesday I attended a meeting held by Nigel Farage at Charing Parish Hall. As a recent joinee to UKIP, I was interested as to what I would see and hear. What surprised me was not what Farage did and said, but the people in the hall. It was standing room only, all the doors and windows were propped open as it was such a warm evening, loads of people were fanning themselves to keep cool. Not one person left before the end. The questions these people asked were salient, their responses to the answers telling.

To contextualise this, Charing is a charming little village between Ashford and Canterbury, it is right out of Darling Buds of May. The whole area is as Tory as Tory can be. There was one person in that packed hall that I would be confident in saying was younger than me, the gap between we two and the rest of the crowd was immense. These were retired people, or people well down the road to retirement. At the outset, Farage asked how many in the hall were UKIP members, fewer than a quarter of the hands went up. At the end of the evening, despite the heat, they were queueing in their droves to sign up as members.

These people ARE the Conservative party, they are the old women with elaborate hair dos, twin-set and pearls that you see at conference every year (or used to before the renta-diversity young crowd were used for doughnutting on the stage). When Farage mentioned Call Me Dave's cast iron guarantee the response from the floor was almost tangible. These people are very, very unhappy about the lie and the situation we now find ourselves in.

These are not the sort of people to bang drums and wave trade union banners, they will not storm Fortnum's or smash up the Savoy. These are the generation that were evacuated during the war, these are the people who have remained stoic in the face of Republican terrorism. There's no histrionics or shouting and chanting of slogans. They just stick their chin out with a steely determination and say, 'we'll see about that'. These are the people that the Conservative party have relied on for generations, and if what I saw on Tuesday night is representative, they're leaving the party in droves.

And you know what? These people have bridge clubs, bowls, coffee mornings, charitable events, and they'll all be telling their friends about how they joined UKIP, about how much sense that charming Mr. Farage spoke, and the word will spread.

If the Tory MP's don't snap Dave out of it, then the pro-euro wing of the Conservative party will have won, and a Pyrrhic victory it will be.

The question you need to ask yourself, as a Tory MP, is not 'can I afford to force the issue with Cameron', but 'can I afford NOT to force the issue with Cameron?'

What I saw on Tuesday was an earthquake, I reckon it is going to generate quite the tsunami. It was the first of such meetings that Farage is running in similar venues around the country, he's hit the demographic perfectly and it could spell very bad news for the Tories very quickly.


Paul said...

My worry that a lot of the older generation of new UKIP people might actually be very socially conservative and be the kind that wants to bring their religion into their politics.

Snowolf said...

You're probably right, Paul. But I'm beyond caring now, until we get out of this hateful organisation nothing else matters. We can all have a big old row once we've got out, but for the love of God, let's get out.

Dick Puddlecote said...

"then grow a fucking pair and force the issue"

On any subject, in every sphere, they are incapable of doing so. Yes here are some, but only the ones who are willing to contravene front bench directives and thus curtail their own careers.

Politics is fatally flawed in that respect.

Paul said...

Agreed, Snowolf. That's the main objective at the end of the day; just be warned that there are a wide range of voices in UKIP and many of us probably don't agree on a lot outside leaving the EU.

The other part I'd like to make is that leaving the EU is seen as a panacea - I think British life has itself been severely degraded (and a lot of people who vote Tory I know are proud of this, and suggest that I move elsewhere in the EU if I don't like it!) and we can't blame that on the EU. If we left the EU, the ignoble nature of our society will still be there. There's more to it than just the EU.

DeeDee99 said...

Nice post; and very good news. I hope Nigel will be including Mole Valley on his list of future events.

If the Coalition staggers on until 2014, when the next EU Parliament elections are due (assuming the Commissars don't cancel them) the British electorate is going to give the Government and the EU the message they have avoided by refusing a Referendum - which is that the vast majority simply want OUT. UKIP are going to win and win big.

None of the Lib/Lab/CON will be able to ignore the result and neither will the BBC. That will be a wonderful kick-start to the GE the following year. However, whilst it will be marvellous to be the largest British Party in Brussels, it is in Westminster that the fight to extracate ourselves from the EUSSR must be won. I think you are right - UKIP is going to seriously damage the CONservative vote at the next GE. I shall be doing my utmost to reduce Sir Paul Beresford's majority.

thespecialone said...

I am an ex-Tory party member and loathe Cameron (yes I have posted similar on other blogs!). What I have not said is that I am in 2 minds whether to join UKIP. Is UKIP just about Farage or are there others who don't get the recognition doing good things?
I have read with interest Richard North's opinions of Farage and UKIP and he doesn't seem particularly impressed and just wished UKIP would get out there and sell the message.
As a 50 yr old who was in my 20s during Maggie's time, I am so fed up with politicians of all parties that at the moment UKIP seem to be the only party that say most about what I agree with.
Do I bite the bullet and sign up to UKIP? I have even thought about standing for councillor for them.

Snowolf said...

Well, for what it's worth, Special One, I'm of the opinion that Farage is a self-obsessed egotist.

But that doesn't mean he can't get the job done. I understand North's view, but the evidence I've seen thus far is that he is now working to get the message out there. This is easier now the Express has come onside, and looking at the Mail, I don't think it will be long until they wade in as well.

A bit of adroit movement during silly season could see some ground made up while the LibDems self-destruct, Labour flounder under a liability of a leader with no credible replacement and the Tories bounce along with the cracks widening with every jolt.

In response to Paul's response to my response (eh?), I don't particularly care what the views of UKIP members are beyond the withdrawal from the EU. It certainly won't be a panacea, but if we are to sort out those issues, the only way we can do it is under our own steam and without having one hand tied behind our backs.

Let's get this sorted and then we can worry about the rest.

thespecialone said...

It helps that the Express are more and more eurosceptic and also the Mail is more and more so. I just wish that the media would take interest in other worthy members other than Farage. Ok, he is the voice that everybody knows, but it would help that the likes of the Express give other UKIP members a voice too.

The party must lay it out clear exactly what the EU is. It is not just about curved bananas or the size of cucumbers. It is a totally undemocratic corrupt organisation. UKIP must lay out the facts and not let the media talk about bananas. The facts must be facts and not half-truths. It must try to get business leaders onside who would look at the bigger picture. It must certainly point out in graphic detail the absurdity and extremely costly EU diktats about 'climate change'. Yes I know that MSM are still basically in the MMGW camp, especially the BBC. Plus, the current UKIP MEPs must be whiter than white with regards to their expenses. The media would love to catch any UKIP MEP being on the gravy train whilst at the same time being in a party that wants to leave the EU.
Finally one last point, the party must have a binding contract with the electorate in that the party will serve the voters who are the masters/mistresses.

Anonymous said...

Dear Snowolf

Good news about the meeting in Kent.

Like many UKIP members I am a conservative, unable to support a Conservative Party which isn’t. Many ex-Lib Dem and ex-Labour members of UKIP are also conservative.

Re Nigel Farage - do self-obsessed egotists apologise for the inconvenience of taking up an offer of help? Do they listen to you?

Nigel is very hard working, following a punishing schedule. Undoubtedly he makes mistakes: like most in UKIP, he is still learning as he goes after nearly 20 years. If he is short with some it may be because they insist on making the same mistakes he made 18 years ago.

@DeeDee99 contact your local branch and offer or seek a lift to the last of four in the South East on Thursday 21 July, 7.30 – 9:30 at Soper Hall, Harestone Valley Road, Caterham, Surrey. CR3 6HY Also to Toby’s garden party on 16 July.


Snowolf said...


ALL leaders of ALL political parties are self-obsessed egotists; it goes with the job. Difference with Farage is he tends to be right more than he is wrong.

Anonymous said...

Dear Snowolf

All generalisations are dangerous, even this one.


The Refuser said...

Quality post old chap. Nothing much to add really but I will say I have been voting for UKIP for some time now, and will continue to do so. They may not be perfect, but look at the alternative?

Cameron is just Ted Heath for the new millenium. The Tories are now throwing a few scraps to the faithful with bullshit claims to "do something" about the HRA.

Maybe a few chumps will be taken in, but I believe the grey vote is going to crucify Cameron at the next election. He misled the faithfull and they will repay his betrayal in spades.

The Libs are finished. Give it a couple of months and they will be tearing themselves apart as the prospect of annihilation looms ever closer. Happy d.ays

Anonymous said...

Dear Snowolf

@ The Refuser

"They may not be perfect..."

You are 'they'.

Stand as a candidate and make 'them' more or less perfect.